Wednesday, 2 May 2007

A Piece Of My Mind - JIB Finalists

As many will know, I have been feeling a bit annoyed over the past few days. There have been somethings I have wanted to say. The time has come to say something because it has really been eating away at me.

Batya has posted an article today, which for me is just the tip of the ice burg, you can read it here.

In the article Batya speaks of the difference between blogs with a large base of readers due to lots of friends and family and those who are 'media-based'.

She goes on to say:

"Dry Bones is great, but he has been featured in the Jerusalem Post for decades. He shouldn't be running in JIB Awards against ordinary bloggers, even the megas. The same goes for Tamar Yona of Arutz 7. She's a major radio personality there."


This is the comment I have left on Batya's blog:

"Hi Batya,
I understand where you are coming from and I agree somewhat.

Dry Bones does have a great blog and it is very popular.

Tamar Yonah however, may be a 'major radio personality', but she certainly is not a 'major' blogger.

Check her technorati ranking here
Rank: 536,218 (22 links from 9 blogs). It seems she gets hardly any traffic to her blog, yet she managed to get almost 200 votes all up in the 2 categories she was nominated in, even beating Aussie Dave in one of them!


Now, I ask, these are 'blogging' awards aren't they?


I don't remember the JIB's being radio awards?!

It was never supposed to be a popularity contest, it is supposed to be about awarding quality blogs, but now it seems its a contest who can rort the voting the most, it seems you don't really even need to have a blog."

I am sick of it. I am sick of the amount of people who have rorted these awards, and who expect other bloggers - 'real bloggers' not to say anything. It is not just this one, it has happened in other categories also. There were a few other blogs that either have basically very few readers and/or post very rarely and yet have somehow managed to get heaps more votes than some of the very well known bloggers who have large readerships.

This is certainly not a case of sour grapes - and I don't care what anyone says about that, but, I was against a similar blog in the 'Best Personal Blog' group I was in. The 90th Minute, this blogger also happens to be a journalist with articles appearing in publications including Haaretz, the Jewish Telegraphic Agency, The Jerusalem Post and European Jewish Press. Her technorati ranking can be found here, she is ranked Rank: 1,083,235 (8 links from 4 blogs)

Considering her readership and traffic to her blog, I find it hard to believe just over 100 votes have been from legitimate readers and not from the fact she is in the media and able to pull votes that way.

Another 'blog' that is in the service industry is JobMob. JobMob is a web site which helps people find jobs in Israel. They qualified in the JIB's for Best New blog with 79 votes (placed 2nd behind Tamar Yonah) and just missed out qualifying for Best Overall Blog with 68 votes. Both nominations of which I find a joke.

It seems that some journalists/ media organisations and service industries are using these awards purely as a promotional campaign to expose themselves to traffic and further their media profiles.

It is the real bloggers who are suffering because of this. The awards have been well run by the committee, but in hind sight, there really needs to be some form of criteria for each category for blog nominations to prevent this sort of abuse - it is not what the awards are supposed to be about.



.... Just another day ....

38 comments:

~ Sarah ~ said...

" some form of criteria for each category for blog nominations" - so like a category for professional journalists with blogs or company/organisations blog and a separate category for regular 'real' bloggers who really are what make the Jblogsphere what it is. Makes sense what you've said. Maybe next year they'll take this on board and change the categories so it's more fair.

Ezzie said...

It's a big issue. Honestly, I didn't even know what these blogs were until they got tons of votes... and to some extent, still don't. It's definitely something that needs to be addressed next year.

Irina Tsukerman said...

Sarah: That's a good idea... but there's the problem of having to check every nomination to determine who's a professional journalist and who's not. Personally, I haven't heard of either of these people before the nominations started... and while it's certainly possible to do that to some extent, I'm not sure we'll have enough professionals to get their own categories... which may not be fair for them, either. But it'd definitely worth considering.

muse said...

When I dashed off that quick little post this morning I had no idea how it would be received. I tried not to get too "involved" this time, but I'm not the type of person to just mumble to myself.

A few months ago I wrote a post asking what a blog is when today all sorts of mainstream publications and news sources have "blogs." What is a blog?

If there is to be another JIB Awards, I suggest a few changes.

Baleboosteh said...

Thank you all for your comments. I actually feel a lot better this morning since last nights rant.

I hope you guys realise this post is not at all anti committee. I support the committee and have insight into just how much time, effort and work has gone into these awards and my thanks goes to them.

I also think that being the first year the awards have been run by a committee there are bound to be a few mistakes/hiccups along the line - it is a learning process and there needs to be some changes for future JIBs.

Hind sight is a wonderful thing...

David said...

It's been discussed at length on DovBear and admitted that the 2007 JIBs are not about quality, and it now looks like the JIBs are not about having a level playing field for all bloggers. Not to mention that people in specific countries couldn't vote at all.

I do think, though, that many of the problems are, indeed, the fault of the committee.

They had months to prepare for this and the contest has never been run so poorly, IMO, despite having so many people involved and ample time.

Sure, mistakes are made, but I can't really attribute the recent attacks on you and BB as "mistakes," nor the lack of support from specific people.

When great blogs like this one, me-ander, and many others don't get recognition, exposure, or traffic from being in the JIBs, what exactly is the real point of the JIBs?

Jack's Shack said...

and it now looks like the JIBs are not about having a level playing field for all bloggers.

And the fake peoples choice awards never operated on a level playing field either.

It has been quite clear that there are a couple of people running around trying to besmirch the JIBs because they have personal issues.


When great blogs like this one, me-ander, and many others don't get recognition, exposure, or traffic from being in the JIBs, what exactly is the real point of the JIBs?


Actually the truth is that many blogs have received more exposure/recognition from the JIBs.

But let's ignore that for a moment and focus on something. They have always been based upon popularity. They have always been subject to the whims of participants.

In simple terms that means that there is no significant difference between now and past awards.

Is it ridiculous to include some of these other blogs?

Yes, it is ridiculous. But regardless there are certain things that never change.

You can dress a pig in silk but it is still a pig. Good content is always a key component of a good blog.

The most effective way to raise your profile and generate readers is through blog carnivals.

Why waste so much energy worrying about whether you win an award.

Baleboosteh said...

Jack,
Good to see you have found my new blog since I returned to blogging 5 weeks ago, and that you have popped over to say hello.
However, could you please not come here to attack people. If you have a problem with David, I think it is fair to ask that you deal with that on your blog, not here on mine.

Jack's Shack said...

Baleboosteh,

Not really an attack on anyone, just a comment about your post and the JIBs in general.

The big challenge in writing is trying to express thoughts clearly. Without the assistance of verbal and facial clues it sometimes falls short.

Baleboosteh said...

Jack,
"And the fake peoples choice awards never operated on a level playing field either."

Was that not an attack on David at Israel Forum?

"It has been quite clear that there are a couple of people running around trying to besmirch the JIBs because they have personal issues."

Who exactly are you talking about? Are you talking about me? Aaron? Who? If you are talking about Aaron or myself, I really resent that.

Speaking of personal issues and besmirching, it seems there are a few people still obsessing about the Peoples Choice Awards too.

Anyway, nothing positive is going to come from this conversation and I have better things to do with my time so I am ending it now.

Scraps said...

Wow. I only just figured out how to find my Technorati rating (thanks to Ezzie), and even *I* have a higher ranking than that blogger you mentioned (674,070 if anyone cared). That's beyond ridiculous.

David said...

Baleboosteh,

Very well said.

Thank you.

Akiva said...

First, a comment I left over at Me-Ander...

This is a very valid point that we didn't consider. There are now professional blogs, organization blogs, and blogs as an accessory of another major activity (web site, radio program, etc).

It's going to be hard to figure out how to segregate them, but must be done in the future. As far as this year is concerned, I think we're too far in to be making that kind of change.

(Examples in this years awards, not all of which did well, we have 1 blog that runs on the Jerusalem Post web site, 1 that runs on the Israel National News web site, 2 by people who have radio programs, 1 associated with a magazine, and 3 associated with organizations.)

Dry Bones is an ultra hard case, because he takes his professional cartoon, but adds back commentary that you can find no where else. And, the blog isn't professionally associated with his offline activity.
------

Now a segway for a moment. David / IsraelForum put out a lot of effort to run the awards. Personally, I thought it was unfair, with no criteria specified, for the JIB title to be pulled from his efforts due to "criteria".

That said, historical JIBs have had problems, and each year they/we try to fix the problems of the past and anticipate those of this year. Guess what, we're not divine, we can neither anticipate everything nor resolve everything.

Some blogs, especially smaller ones, have reported major traffic increases after being 'found' through the JIBs. By that criteria, we're very successful.

Now to your direct point... closely managing the categories and validating participants is very much in conflict with inclusiveness. Who are you, me, or someone else to decide whether a particular blog qualifies as right wing, or left wing, or photo versus music. Ok, in some cases it's obvious, but in others... It's hard enough getting _active_ volunteers, who thinks we can get, oh, 5 committed volunteers _from across the spectrum_ to 'validate' category nominations?

You think people complain about the JIBs now, try what happens when you disqualify a blog from a category.

I strongly agree that 'professional / organizational' versus 'amateur' categories are needed. But except in cases that are very obvious, these judgements are not so clear cut. For example, if a radio personality or journalist or writer has a blog, but they are not directly associated with their professional career, is that 'professional'? (A news journalist has a cooking blog, professional? A child's story writer has a political blog, professional?)

----
Responding directly to what David wrote, and since he left a tough comment here I think that's fair...

David, you've make your complaints well known through your various forums and aliases (watcher, Ploni, Me). As I wrote above, I don't agree nor was a part of what happened last year. Hurting this year's JIBs is not going to get back at those who attacked you last year. Rather, it's going to harm other people who, like you last year, are just trying to do their best.

Don't step into the role of those people.

David said...

Hello Akiva,

I guess I should be flattered that you would attribute to me all those screen names and their excellent, extensive work, but it seems fairly obvious that there are many people involved.

You may think that I’m an artist, a political cartoonist, a prolific writer, a blogger, an expert programmer, a producer of the best blog aggregating service :), and a keen observer of your awards, etc., etc. I would humbly respond that the people involved in all those screen names are much more talented than I am, and I could not and would not take credit for their work.

I am, however, a proud supporter and contributor to some of the more humorous criticism of this year’s JIB awards and some of the people with whom you’re associated. You should know that the Ploni Baloney blog, in particular, enjoys contributions like content, artwork, ideas, and private and public support from several well-known JBloggers – yes, including some mega-bloggers -- who prefer to voice their opinions anonymously.

I criticize and oppose the JIB process this year for good reason.

It’s common knowledge from comments all over the JBlogosphere, including the JIBs official site, that this year’s contest is corrupt, tainted with cheating, self-promotion, and the barring of entire countries from voting, as well as the awarding of anti-Israeli, and probably anti-Semitic blogs. This is in addition to an enormous amount of infighting and ugliness that has resulted in the closing of two of the best JBlogs, including the forerunner to this one.

With all due respect, the increased traffic claims that you make, are simply not supported by the public referrer reports for participating blogs. I invite you to examine the free referrer scripts that many bloggers post on their blogs and see how many visitors entered from the JIB site, divided by the number of days that have passed since the beginning of the JIBs. On average, the 2007 JIB contestants gained 2-4 visitors per day from the JIB site, and this includes the bloggers themselves clicking through many times.

I also respectfully question your willingness to be associated with two of this year’s JIB committee members who are known to you personally to have taken actions to destroy the previous JIB awards with nothing but pure malice. You’re not the only JIB member at fault, but since you stepped up to the plate to discuss this, I will mention you, although I want to clarify that I have absolutely nothing personal against you.

As for the JIBs I ran last time, I would say that when I responded to Aussie Dave’s call for help to JBlog Central directly, I had been in the JBlogosphere for only 6 months and I did not know the extent of the problems associated with the JIBs. I am relieved to no longer be involved with the JIBs. You will probably feel this relief, too, when these dreaded awards are over.

I see that you’ve invested a lot of time and effort into running the technical side of the JIBs and you even had to do marketing for it, since the original PR failed. You deserve the gratitude of the JBlogging community, but it would be appropriate for you to fix the problems you are aware of, instead of just claiming to do better “next year.” Now is the time to do the right thing, Akiva.

Like you asked me, I will ask of you, too: Please do not hurt the JBlogging community by having the judges run for awards, by having non-legitimate votes count, by not giving entire countries the right to vote, by shutting out voters with a flawed voting system, by pitting professional blogs against personal ones, and by awarding anti-Semitic blogs.

It might also be appropriate for you to open a thread on one of your blogs to discuss this.

Aussie Dave said...

Akiva,

Firstly, I have to extend my appreciation for all the hard work you have put in to this year's awards. I of all people know how time consuming they are, and you have clearly put my time and effort into them.

Regarding the Israel Forum awards, I was very clear - and fair - about the reasons for pulling away my support.

"A few months ago, Israel Forum kindly agreed to run this year's JIB awards, due to my inability and lack of desire to be involved this year. And I want to state for the record, I think they have tried their best to make it work. It is a thankless job, especially when you are subject to nasty and unfair criticism, as I believe my friends at Israel Forum have been.

Having said that, I cannot pretend to be pleased with the format of the awards. I voiced my displeasure at the concept of the voting being based solely on the JBlogCentral voting, since I believe this voting system is being abused (as Bagelblogger noted a few weeks ago).

And there are other issues - such as the fact that entries in the category Best Post/Series are not reflective of the category, but are merely pointing to the blog itself.

But for me, the main problem is that the lack of publicity, and the rushed nature of proceedings, have compromised the very aim of the JIBs - namely to promote Jewish, Israeli, and pro-Israel blogs to the general public.

Consequently, I have requested that the name JIBs be dropped from these awards. The JIBs will be back soon, true to their traditional format.

Again, let me stress that I think Israel Forum has tried very hard to make this work, admittedly with very little in the way of assistance from me, and with much in the way of undeserved criticism (a major reason why I gave up running the JIBs). Therefore, I ask that you fully support these awards. Just don't call them the JIBs."

I do not need to elaborate on this, but will say that given my effort to be respectful, I did not expect the vitriolic attacks on my character from the likes of Ploney, who has a suspiciously similar writing style to someone else, despite his claims otherwise.

David does have some valid points about this year's JIBs, though. Especially the decision to allow anti-Israel blogs like Muzzlewatch to compete, in the spirit of "inclusiveness." This needs to be changed if the JIBs are to achieve their purposes.

Akiva said...

David - There is a thread open, RIGHT ON THE JIBAWARDS.COM home page. We're not filtering comments, come on by and have your say.

Dave - We polled a number of Jbloggers for their category opinions in advance, as well as solicited community input (on the site).

If the JIBs are the zionist right wing Jewish blog awards, then I agree with you. If they are the Jewish & Israeli blog awards, then those with various viewpoints on the matter are welcome.

The rules spell it out reasonably well I think... "1. What Blogs May Be Included?

Jewish & Israel Blogs (and/or those frequently dealing with those topics) of course! Blogs qualify for nomination if they are operated by or have significant contributions from Jewish and/or Israeli bloggers or frequently deal with Jewish topics or Israel/Israeli topics. A blog does not have to have Jewish bloggers nor be pro-Israel to be included.

Anti-Semitic and/or blogs advocating the destruction of Israel are specifically excluded. For this purpose, being critical of or advocating a major change in Israeli government structure, operation, policies or political positions is not considered 'advocating the destruction of Israel'."

Is there some part of that you disagree with? I'm a right wing zionist who spends significant time in the Shomron, but I advocate some major changes in Israeli government structure and stand on things. So, would I be excluded?

You have to be awful careful about filtering, you never know who might get caught up.

Aussie Dave said...

Akiva,

Why are you explaining to me the criteria? I invented the awards, and I know what the purpose is. I was surprised the criteria was changed, and would have hoped the rules as I defined them were kept.

My rule was :

"4. A blog is ineligible for being nominated if, although it is written by a Jewish blogger, the content of the blog is anti-Israel, or even anti-Semitic.

The above does not include blogs which contain earnest discussion about the merits of certain Israeli policies."

I also added the following test:
"Is this [blog] considered anti-Israel by the layperson, regardless of his/her political orientation?" I believe this is a fair test, and one which will ensure the purpose of the awards is not compromised.

When I was running the awards, sites such as Jewschool did compete since they passed the test. I think some of the sites this year would have failed it.

David said...

I do not need to elaborate on this, but will say that given my effort to be respectful, I did not expect the vitriolic attacks on my character from the likes of Ploney

Dave,

I saw that post and didn't think it was an attack on your character.

Without getting into more negativity, I would just say that you might consider the possibility that some people may have the right to voice legitimate criticism of your actions. Just a thought. No offense intended.

David - There is a thread open, RIGHT ON THE JIBAWARDS.COM home page. We're not filtering comments, come on by and have your say.

Akiva,

I appreciate the referral, but no thanks. That thread is a graveyard for suggestions. No point in wasting my time or yours.

Looks like you've got much bigger problems on your hands, like the JIB awards for certain anti-Semitic blogs and establishing whether the JIBs are still what people think they are supposed to be now that the rules have changed and anti-Semitic blogs are included in the contest.

That's really going to be a tough one for you to resolve. Good luck.

Aussie Dave said...

David,

The post referred to me as a tool, someone out for self-publicity, and with my own agenda - way beyond any "legitimate" criticism of my actions.

But of course we both know who Ploney is.

Ted W. Gross said...

I just came across this post and am really not in the habit of getting into debates about such things. Whatever floats your boat is the best way to go.

I will just make an observation or two.. and before beginning this is NOT an attack on anyone, cause I dont know any of you bloggers or your blogs to be honest.

I run four blogs. I am not a professional blogger but I am a writer. Anyone can open a blog; anyone can fill it up with interesting stuff or junk. Anyone can write whatever they damn please in a blog. It is up to the READERS to decide if they want to read it or not.

One of my blogs is in the JIB and all four are up in JBlog Central. The one that is up is a recipe blog. It has already won awards before. Should it have won an award? Should it not? That was up to readers to decide.

IMHO those who run the JIB made a few newbie mistakes. BUT that is to be expected. They are learning as they go which is commendable and certainly deserves respect. The worst mistake is that they, or the Jewish Blogging community does not seem to know, that prestigious blog awards are given out every year, for example the WebLog Awards - or bloggies. It is a shame they did not adopt that method...which btw, was also steeped in great controversy at the beginning in 2000, and 2001 and 2002.

Blogs are Blogs are Blogs. When I take a look at some of the posts in some blogs at JBlog it makes me want to puke. Others I can only laugh at; and others speak to me. That is the nature of the game. I read some posts of Bloggers who dont live in Israel - but have such a cavalier attitude about going to war. I dont agree..and I have been in quite a few wars. Does that make their feelings not legitimate? Should we filter their blogs as well?

Where does it begin? Where does it end?

But it is wrong, IMHO, to try and "exclude" a blog - EVEN when we know that it is used for PR purposes. BECAUSE...I use my blogs for PR purposes as well. And I think most of you bloggers do as well.

The JPost just put an article up about one of its reporters winning an award from BB (I think) for his blog reporting a convention! That is totally completely ridiculous and really stupid and bent. BUT he got the award. Period. End of Story. And that is the bottom line. Was it fixed? Was it fair? The reporter in question does not even write well. But that is MHO. It is his award.

LIVE WITH IT.

Less grumbling about the way JIB's are going; a bit more positive input; some patience - will go a long away.

My 2 cents...

Teddy

Mr Bagel said...

Ted, I accept most of your observations, and indeed agree on some of them, but I disagree with the sentiment expressed in your statement:

"BECAUSE...I use my blogs for PR purposes as well. And I think most of you Bloggers do as well."

This doesn't ring true. I would suggest the vast majority of blogs that previously competed in the JIB's were of 2 major genres.

1. Most people want the chance to 'express their thoughts/opinions', and relate socially, blogging is ideal for this.

2. Some Bloggers are motivated by a desire to advocate in some way for either Jewry or Israel or a combination of both.

Which, I don't deem 'PR', certainly not in the context you appear to have been using it in.

PR is not the main motivator of most Bloggers.

Even if it were the main motivator, I think a lot of the objection towards some of this years entries, is the apparent insincerity of some so called 'blogs'.

Some of us spend thousands of hours doing our blogs, and we do it with a passion.

I resent personally someone using a 'out of the box' blog - 'I'll write a few posts, then utilise my 'media reach'/ employees/clients to vote on it and win myself some more publicity and a blogging award'.

When the main activity of the 'Blogger' (I use that word loosely) is in another field altogether - which is obvious by the quality and quantity of blog posting, runs for a blog award, knowing they're not even close to the middle of the field, this is the very definition of Chutzpah.

Blogs aren't something you can sticky tape onto the side of your marketing campaign as an after thought, then expect respect from 'fellow Bloggers'.

The reason why you are able to incorporate a PR element, is you put effort in, and that gets respect.

You Ted, blog and then use this as a PR exercise, fine I have no problem with that.

Some use PR and create a 'out of the box' blog, which on its own would be a very lonely creature indeed, but then utilise a non blogging avenue to drive traffic to the JIB's to vote for it.

Some of this years 'contests' have been driving traffic to the JIB's to vote for their blog, but they seem forget to even mention where their blog is!!

Shalom Aaron
Visit: Mr Bagel

Jameel @ The Muqata said...

Hi Baleboosteh --

As a "competitor" with the Tamar Yona blog and Dry Bones, I certaintly agree that it's not really "fair" -- though last year when I competed against "Little Green Footballs" it was the same thing. LGF blew me away...with no chance of winning a JIB.

I would like to state that I think DryBones is a wonderful comic and a great blog...and I hope to go up against him fair and square :-)

However, for Tamar Yonah use her radio show to get JIB votes when people never read her blog on a regular basis is just annoying.

I do take issue that the current JIBs are not about "quality".

When the JPOST ran them last year it was also a popularity contest.

I view the JIBS primarily as a way to get more exposure for my blog. If I win an award or not, it doesn't really matter...(except if I win, I will host a victory waffle breakfast :)

Ted W. Gross said...

Mr Bagel:

(I assume that is what we should call you :$ )

I am far beyond wondering or judging what anyone else writes their blogs for or for what reasons. But I stand by a couple of things:

1. I am not a professional blogger, and honestly have no intention of becoming one.

2. I use my own blogs to discuss things I know and like.

3. I have no clue whatsoever what motivates others in the blogging world.

4. And I personally, find absolutely nothing wrong if one manages to hit a niche that becomes wildly popular - to use it as PR for their own ends. Now you may not understand what I mean about PR and perhaps it was vague. But I will try to be more specific.

When I started Help! I Have A Fire In My Kitchen, and it is written in the first post - I had no thoughts that it would become what it did. But there was a method in my madness. When 3 months later it was nominated and then won the Best Food Weblog for 2007 @ the Bloggies which is considered a farily prestigious award in the Blogging world on the Internet, hell I didnt even know it was nominated until someone left a congrats comment in the blog itself.

When Google picked Help! I Have A Fire In My Kitchen for it Blogger of the Day, which also has sent hits through the roof, I sure did not complain.

But if you think for one moment, that I did not or will not try to turn that into something to further my writing career you are mistaken. And that is my PR. So if Help! I Have A Fire In My Kitchen wins an award in the JIB's - yes I have ulterior motive - and I am NOT ashamed to admit it.

That forces me though, to spend hours into creating something that people all over the world (and not just Jews) want to read again and again. It is a hobby that spurs my creativity. But I will not lie. I would not be putting so much work into the blogs I run even as a hobby, if there was nothing to be gained from it.

One can call that "cynical". Or one can call it "selfish". Or one can call it just plain common sense. In the world of blogging - you have to stand out against hundreds of thousands of other blogs - most of which are pure junk (not a comment on the JIB's so don't take it as such!)


And Mr. Bagel I have visited your blog. Of course. Hell with a name like Mr. Bagel - I had to! You sell stuff. You have a "shop" in your menu. That too is PR. You have a 4 column spread which means you had to severely change the normative Blogger Beta format (I come from the world of high tech). So you too do use the posts in your blog to draw people - to do PR.

Which I think is a very good thing and should be seen in a positive light.

MHO once again

Mr Bagel said...

Hi Ted, very briefly I have no problem with you 'deriving a benefit from your blog' and if you read my comment a little closer you would see that. [end]

Thanks for the insight into the webbies, I was already aware of your prominent google positioning.

It was mainly directed at 'blogging sincerity and intent', your blog is, well, a blog, always has been, some others aren't. Pure and simple.

By the way, apart from running some unpaid referals to help fellow bloggers. I have never advertised, I do have the skeleton of a shop, with no product in it, and I have never sold anything nor have I tried to, but yes I may one day cross over to the 'dark side' and derive a small earning from my work.

Either way my comment was never about deriving a profit from a blog, or even so much being a professional blogger, it was about sincerity, actually competing in a blog award because you feel you have contributed to a degree where you could have a reasonable, (even if small) expectation that you blog is possibly a contender in the appropiate category.

Now, I know there are bloggers who were in the awards who knew they didn't stand a chance, they were in it only for the traffic, fine, again they also didn't announce over national radio to vote for their blog.

In the end, I didn't make it in Best New Blog, but the most important thing is, I still respect the guy in the mirror who brushes my teeth in the morning, something a few 'so called bloggers', who are in the finals, I suspect shouldn't.

If some one feels compelled to reply, I dont belive in tautology, please read this comment fully in the context to my previous comment.

Shalom Aaron

Ted W. Gross said...

Aaron:

I am neither in agreement or disagreement with you. I do not know, nor to be honest do I care to know, who those bloggers that have seemed to piss everyone off - are. What I do know, is that awards are there TO INCREASE TRAFFIC - and that is legitimate. And I could not care if they did pay for a spot on National Radio to win.

Why? Because they are showing aggressiveness and assertiveness. I did not see in any place in JIB and I may be mistaken, cause I truthfully did not read it all, that advertising is wrong.

Let me give you an example if you want to prevent what you guys seem to be all upset about. There is writing award...a fairly well known one...this is one of the rules:

"Any attempt by writers to distort or manipulate the public vote will result in the disqualification of their respected stories. Writers are allowed to promote their own stories during the vote and to ask others to vote for them. Attempts to repeatedly vote for their own story or to compromise the secure voting system will result in disqualification. The editors of XXXXXXX have final authority to determine if any writer is attempting to distort or manipulate the public vote and the editors' decisions regarding disqualification are final and can not be appealed."

Easy. You want to avoid X, Y and Z put it in the rules BEFORE the contest. But complaining while the contest is going on... that is just not sounding good in my ears. Lots of water under the bridge...(I use that cliche cause of the Picture banner in your Blog :) )

But to complain NOW, sorry I don't see it. It is a tough world out there...you want an award...go for it. Fight tooth and nail for it. Just know that everyone else who would like to win it..will do the same.

And hell yes. If I decide to do it, you better believe in a day or so, there will be a post in ALL my blogs, and a sidebanner, telling everyone who hits Help! I Have A Fire In My Kitchen to vote for it.

Why not? That is really legitimate.

I dont know the blogs you guys are going on about... I honestly do not take this as seriously as some I have seen take it. Actually...here is my rule:

The day it stops being fun is the day I delete my blogs.

Smile. Enjoy. Have Fun. Go For The Gold. - And do it in the most aggressive manner you are allowed to within the confines of the contest.

BEAT EM ALL....

and make sure your voice is heard for next year. BUT NOT while the contest is going on.

That is all I am saying

Take it or garbage it

Jack's Shack said...

Let's sum this up. As previously said, the JIBs have always been a popularity contest.

People have always campaigned for them. People have always bitched about the "management."

My problem with Ploni is not that it exists. It irks me because it is a couple of second rate hacks who aren't funny.

It is the equivalent of two 14 year-old boys fighting about who has the bigger winky.

I have seen more impressive work from monkeys flinging crap at the wall. Go ahead and keep up the little circle jerk, this mutual masturbation is ever so impressive.

Better yet keep taking time out of running big impressive companies to argue on message boards about who craps bigger.

In the meantime I am off to play with my trustfund babies.

muse said...

I think I've gotten more new visitors from the various carnivals.
Maybe one of the distinctions should be whether or not the blogger uses his/her real name.
There will always be cheating--human nature, but don't tell my students!

Baleboosteh said...

Jack,
it is obvious we don't see eye to eye on the topic of Ploni - and that is fine.

But, to come here and talk in the manner you have on my personal blog using the language you have and the discriptors you have shows a lack of judgement you are becoming famous for.

I don't care that we disagree on points, but keep your sewer talk on your own blog.

Baleboosteh

David said...

My problem with Ploni is not that it exists. It irks me because it is a couple of second rate hacks who aren't funny.
Josh,

Your problem is that you know that I back the Ploni blog, and you're a disgruntled former employee of my company, whom I personally fired a few years back.

That's why you've been behind every rumor, innuendo, and attempt to discredit me personally and JBLog Central, something I presume you don't hurry to tell others when manipulating them.

Ironically, I attended your son's Bris, met your father and grandparents, met your wife and kids on several occasions, and you've attended my son's Bris, and know my family.

Very ironic, really, that you've gone out of your way to take shots at me whenever given the opportunity, but I understand why. Things have not gone so well for you since we parted ways, and I know that you feel wronged. Everyone does, really.

Despite all that, you should know that I'm not angry at you, and I've made an attempt to reach out to you, but you responded angrily, which is, of course, your choice. At some point, I hope that you can let go of the negativity you feel toward me and toward a whole bunch of other people who really aren't quite so bad as you build them up to be in your mind over time.

Just chill, Josh. Things aren't so bad. You're in control of your fate and can make good or bad choices. I think you know very well what I mean, because I see that you contemplate this kind of stuff on your own blog.

Jack's Shack said...

But, to come here and talk in the manner you have on my personal blog using the language you have and the discriptors you have shows a lack of judgement you are becoming famous for.

Actually I suspect that the reason you are upset is because it is an entirely accurate portrayal of the immature behavior of some regarding the JIBs.

Jack's Shack said...

David, David, David,

Your true colors have come out. I don't need to use 500 words to describe who or what you are.

If it makes you feel good to try and "out" me than by all means have at it. You'll note that I never brought up any of the details that you list here.

I didn't because I am not angry with you. Until this little exchange I didn't spend much time thinking about you at all.

Oh sure my logs show that the frequency with which you visit my blog. It is nice to see that you are so interested in my life.

And I haven't forgotten the mensch who cut the compensation packages of his employees and then went out and purchased a Jaguar for himself and a Mercedes for his wife. Or the many lawsuits that you were involved in.

When I started my company I made sure to remind myself not to behave like this.

The smart thing for you to do is not to engage me in this.

Keep telling the story of the disgruntled employee and feel good that as the boss of a small start up you are able to spend your time playing games while others work.

In the meantime I have to go back to work. Be well.

David said...

Thank you, Josh.

Your posts speak for themselves about your true motivations behind everything you say regarding me and JBlog Central.

It’s just another case of an angry, fired employee trying to strike back against his former boss. It’s really that simple. Unfortunate, but understandable.

I’m sorry that the success of my companies still makes you angry after all this time. I’ve known you for about a decade, and couldn’t help but notice that every company you worked for during those years seems to succeed, while you wind up parting ways under extremely bad terms with personal animosity. The companies you bitterly complain about are, of course, multi-million dollar entities, so I will cheerfully take your description of “small startup” with a grain of salt.

Yes, I do track your various blogs, knowing that one of the main reasons behind your failure is not being able to restrain your mouth (or keyboard). I know that sooner or later, you will stumble either publicly or in private email and infringe on my rights.

Speaking of which, now that you’re middle aged with a wife, kids, mortgage, personal debt, and a host of other financial and health problems, one might think that you would draw some important conclusions. But, by the looks of it, maybe not. I’m sure Jessica must be overjoyed that you are going out of your way to pick fights that are likely to result in yet more financial burden and grief being brought on the family. Does she know about this yet?

Anyway, I’m truly glad to hear that you have your own business and wish you the best.

Please send my regards to Jessica and the kids. Maybe we’ll invite you guys over for a shabbos dinner some time. I’m sure the kids would love it, and we’ll have a chance to catch up on old times. :)

Anonymous said...

David --- You sound like a very malicious person holding a deep grudge. First outing Josh, then after Josh asserts you to be are a very litigitous character you corroborate it with your commenting that you are tracking him to see if he infringes on your rights in public or private and then threatening him with an implied law suit to increase his financial burdon. Your ploni sight is plain nasty to people and you are probably the one corrupting and fraudulating the jib votes and then after you crap on their site you proudly hold it up your **** for everyone to see.

Jack's Shack said...

David,

I can see that I touched a nerve. If you really were secure in your position you wouldn't feel the need to act this way.

It must make you feel like a big man to hide behind the keyboard and issue veiled threats. It must make you feel like a big man to offer innuendo about things you think that you are familiar with.

What it does is reveal your character. I don't need to say anything about you because your actions provide a clear picture of who you are.

I have documented your actions from the very beginning of our "association" through the present. I haven't any concern whatsover about what I do or frankly what you do.

Clearly you feel otherwise. Many people have asked me why all of my blogs are not listed at JBlog Central. I have always replied that I don't know and I dont care.

You'll note that unlike you I don't make smart remarks about your family members, those you speak with, those who refuse to speak with you etc.

It is not that I can't, I just dont think that it is kind to try to harm someone who is already so clearly disturbed.

Just remember that there is a reason why you have never been able to hold onto employees and your actions today go to the heart of it.

BTW, when you storm around the office the way that you have it makes people nervous. Or did I forget to mention that I still speak with a couple of your employees.

Do the right thing and let this go. You aren't going to embarrass me. You aren't going to intimidate me. The best thing is to drop it.

I say that as one Jew to another. Be a mensch about this and suck it up. It is a big blogosphere.

Baleboosteh said...

Jack,
your 'annonymous' comment to David fools noone.

I started off asking you not to bring your negative baggage here... you have ignored me.

I then asked you not to speak in the rude and direspectful manner you have and yet still you keep coming back with more garbage.

Get the message Jack, Josh or whoever you are go away!!!

You are not welcome here, I am not going to heve you come here on my personal blog when you have shown so much disrespect to me.
I was very offended by your 'circle jerk' comment and the 'mutual masturbation' inparticular.

Instead of apologising you have come back with some poor excuse.

Show some respect, how would you feel if a guy came along and left comments on your wifes blog??

Tamara said...

Reading this it would seem to me, correct me if I'm wrong, that there is more than one commentor who has taken advantage of commenting on this post and have decided to fight out a grudge in this forum.

It's more than one or two people, and it's wrong.

DING DING...back to your corners everyone and come out fighting clean!

Rafi G said...

what David did above was totally inappropriate.

As to the post, what irks me is that dead blogs have advanced to the finals. There are blogs, that have not posted in 6 months and have hung it up, yet somehow managed to advance.

Baleboosteh said...

Rafi,
there have been heated tempers on both sides.

The fact of the matter is Jack took it to far and was way out of line with his rudness on my blog.

There is no need for the language he used on any blog especially mine.


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